Left Face
Join Adam Gillard and Dick Wilkinson while they talk politics and community engagement in Pikes Peak region.
Left Face
Honoring Heroes and Exploring Veteran Support
What happens when formal debate techniques meet the fiery realm of political discourse? Join us on Left Face as we navigate the nuanced landscape of competitive public speaking and political debate. We begin by dissecting the recent Presidential debate, where we spotlight Vice President Harris's compelling performance and the subtle yet powerful influence of media bias. Dick draws from his extensive experience in high school and college debates, offering a behind-the-scenes look at formats like Lincoln-Douglas and team debates, and explaining why debaters must be agile enough to argue both sides of a topic.
We then shift our focus to the emotional tug-of-war that political candidates engage in during televised debates. Learn how trust-building tactics and emotional appeals have evolved from precise technical discussions to captivating narratives. We speculate on the possibility of another debate between Donald Trump and Kamala Harris, examining the strategic calculations each might make. We also touch on Trump’s rocky relationships with his vice presidents and cabinet members, and delve into the paradoxical support he garners from veterans despite his publicized clashes with military leaders.
Closing on a heartfelt note, we recount a moving memorial ceremony, complete with touching speeches, a dramatic flyover, and the haunting strains of a bagpipe tribute. We also celebrate veteran entrepreneurship in Colorado Springs, discussing the challenges and resources available to veteran business owners. Finally, stay connected with our community as we preview upcoming Veterans Day events and provide details on how to participate. Tune in for an episode brimming with insights, heartfelt moments, and invaluable information for veterans and military enthusiasts alike!
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Hello everyone and welcome to the All Things Military and Veteran Podcast. My name is Adam Gillard. Joining me is Dick Wilkinson. But before we go any further, after the debacle last week with the name, we made a decision to change it. So, dick, tell us the words that you can say.
Speaker 2:Okay. So I apologize because I know Adam named this program or worked with people to name it, and then I showed up and didn't get it right. So we have decided to change it to Left Face. The command to everybody in the military knows to turn to the left and pay attention to something that's important over there. So we have taken it upon ourselves to leave that military theme in there but make the name a lot more simple. So Left Face is what we've settled with.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I've been thinking about name change for a long time because, yeah, the last one was just a mouthful and you know, even like the name of the group's a mouthful, so like trying to say like them all together, especially when you're trying to do like the sponsorships and things like that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the promotional stuff, it's like it's always a mouthful. So, yeah, left face, I think it's a great, great name. We toyed with a few for a few weeks there, but I think this is going to work out well for us, so that's great. Next thing we wanted to talk about was, you know, the big debate that we had the other night. You know, obviously, I think Vice President Harris did a great job. Uh, I think she laid out some pretty good uh, um, policy issues and plans and, just you know, more than just a concept for a plan. She actually had some numbers associated with that concept for a plan, um. But it's funny when I look at some of what the media says, because whichever side you're you're reading, they want.
Speaker 2:That's the side, yeah, media says because whichever side you're you're reading, they want that's the side that, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:And so for me, like it's hard you know I understand my own biases, Like I understand that I come into these things heavily biased, you know, you know towards the left. But I legitimately want to know, like how do people look at debates and decide who wins a debate, Right, Right and I never did that stuff in high school or anything like that, but you have some experience in that. Yes, what was your experience with like debate and like how does like a real debate work?
Speaker 2:Sure, when I was a kid, everybody said Dickie, you have to grow up and be a lawyer, because you argue all the time and that's, that's got to be your job. You have to get paid to argue. And so when I was in middle school and high school, I found out that a path towards that type of profession was learning how to do public speaking and doing it in different styles and different ways, so that you would be capable if you needed to argue a case. I never really had an interest in going into law, but I thought arguing for fun, arguing as a competition, that's me. I want to do that, right, you know. So I got into the competitive aspect of, uh, arguing about, you know, debate in high school, and one of the things I think that our listeners should understand and appreciate is that if you do debate competitively, whether it's high school or collegiate and every now and then these things show up on C-SPAN and they get a little coverage, maybe on the Ocho for ESPN the.
Speaker 2:National Debate Championships SmackDown in Sarasota.
Speaker 1:So I saw one recently of that and it was unintelligible. Oh really, yeah, and it was like the National Championship and they just said their thing so fast. And it was just like they had to say everything. And it wasn't so much trying to win somebody's argument, you were just making points, sure, sure, and it was really hard to understand what the point was.
Speaker 2:Even so good observation there that there's more than one kind or style of debate in competitive debate. And so there's Lincoln, one kind or style of debate in competitive debate. And so there's Lincoln. Douglas is a style of debate that's very popular. And then there is this other cooperative team debate. Baylor University runs, you know, this one style where it's broken down a little bit differently. So the difference there is in Lincoln Douglas it's one person versus one person and the rhythm of point and counterpoint is structured. So you have this much time to make an argument and then you have this much time for a rebuttal.
Speaker 1:And that's pretty much what we saw on Tuesday.
Speaker 2:Yes, exactly, and that is in the style of Lincoln-Douglas debate. Yes, and it's up to the moderator on TV. Their rules are a lot different and they negotiate them as they go, but the collegiate ones, the rules, are traditional and stuck. Yeah, what you saw, there was somebody who that structure of debate was down to, like you said, covering certain content points, and you get scored based on content points, maybe not necessarily scored as highly on whether you motivated the judge to believe you or not, right, but the intention of the debate is, you know you're, you're motivating the judges usually a panel of three to believe your position.
Speaker 2:And the thing that I wanted our listeners to understand is when you do it competitively and this is something you can consider when you see the presidential debates when you do it competitively and this is something you can consider when you see the presidential debates you must be prepared that the way it goes is either there's a topic that runs all season long and you might go to 10 debates that season. It's always going to be the same topic. You've got all your research, all your talking points, lots of information, but when you show up there will be a twist. The twist is you don't know if you're for or against the point that day, you don't know. And then if you do, let's say three debates that day. You may be for, against, against, you may be for, for, for, you don't know. And so every debate you have to be ready to pivot into the position of I support this or I'm against this. And sometimes the topics are really challenging.
Speaker 2:The one that I did in high school was is gender equality? So just male and female? Is gender equality required for an effective democracy? That was the topic all season long put out by Baylor, and Baylor University structured these debates and then that's how the whole state of Texas competes, right, and so we had to research that topic and I had a partner, and it was a male and a female that we were. We teamed up like that and we would take turns. You know, as the structure was set up, where one of us would give a point and then one would give the rebuttal and then, depending if you were for or against, changed who went first.
Speaker 2:Right, and so you have to be capable of arguing from every position and in every part of the debate. So that's really the takeaway for the listeners and for everybody here is politicians are trying to win your emotional sway in a debate. They really want to speak to your emotional response about a topic more than numbers and logic, Whereas competitive ones may come down to. I proved that this topic does more good for society and that was the goal was to say these 20 talking points about how much money this thing could make in a pretend you in situation.
Speaker 1:Right, you know that's a lot different. Yeah, and that's something that you know. Trump obviously really excels at is getting the, the emotional response from people without much substance behind it, but he still draws that emotional response, and so that's why.
Speaker 2:So when you hear, like your first question, and what brought us into this? How does the media decide? Or the people who even moderated the debate? Like there's never a winner at the end, like in a fight, where they hold up their hand and say this person won.
Speaker 2:That does happen in competitions, right, that's how you get your trophy. But in the political debate that happens in the ballot box right Now, there's still a call or a judgment on who won a debate in a presidential situation. That comes down to the belief of who swayed more opinion or who affected more emotional change in the observers, right In the people watching. And that's why, when they do these focus groups and when the media really likes to take a small group of sampling of people from a battleground County somewhere and say we got five you know Trump people, five Harris people and we put them all in a room and nobody knew who was who, right, and then you get to watch you know that focus group. The comments are always down to. I believe.
Speaker 2:I believe that they said this, I believe they're going to do this, they make me feel this way about this thing and that I guess that gives me hope, right, that's an unmeasurable, unquantifiable feeling. Right, that gets quantified only by the ballot box. But the intention there for any politician, no matter what level of debate, you know if you're doing it for the mayor or the president, it doesn't matter if you're the one doing it, the the knowledge and what your team is feeding you is how to sway that emotional base, how to increase trust in your thoughts and your positions on whatever the topics are, and that that drives the conversation completely right. There People lose debates, and we saw this more back in the eighties and nineties, where people tried to have technical conversations during a debate, where they tried to tell you about a specific dollars and cents, about how they were going to balance a budget or how much money they were going to spend in one department. Those were abysmal failures for those people and so nobody does that anymore.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so do you think there's going to be a another debate? Do you think both sides would want to do another debate?
Speaker 2:I think Donald Trump would. I think he's interested in doing another debate is not because he needs to sway more voters, it would be more to save face, I guess. And and end, you know, end as the winner, you know, win the final round if you will, and have that as the last thing he can look back at. I found out the other day he's done the most presidential debates of anybody in history, which is really crazy.
Speaker 2:I thought you know, but he's ran three times right, and we're so used to seeing him on tv all the time that you, you know, oh, he's in debate or he's at a rally or whatever, it doesn't matter. But anyways, I think trump would do another one to save face. I don't know that harris, as I saw some other pundits talk about harris, I don't think has anything to win by going and doing another debate yeah, she proved the character flaws that she needed to prove.
Speaker 2:She was light on policy, but enough to say she's got an idea and in this timeframe, I think that's all we're going to get. So why walk back into the fire If you you already got through it? You didn't get burned, everything went well. Yeah, don't force.
Speaker 1:Don't go back for another round, yeah, who knows what can come up then.
Speaker 2:Yeah, forced error, I think, is really what it would come down to, right. Yeah, somebody would figure out a way to actually get Trump to say the right thing and she could fall into a trap.
Speaker 1:And then you know, that's not good for her, yeah, and I think her and Wallace's ground game is way superior to Trump's. Like, if you look at their schedules, they're hitting a lot more states. They're doing a lot more stops throughout. You know Trump's schedule is pretty light when it comes to campaigning.
Speaker 2:Seems like he's got JD Vance out Doing most of the footwork right now.
Speaker 1:When he threw him under the bus for the abortion question.
Speaker 2:I mean, this is Donald Trump has proven that he has zero love for his Vice President, no matter who it is, no matter how much it could be his son, and he would throw his son under the bus. He'd be like Don Jr. I don't know why he thought that.
Speaker 1:You know he would do that, no problem right.
Speaker 2:So if you take that job, you are a whipping boy for a man who has no love for you.
Speaker 1:Any position in his cabinet?
Speaker 2:In his cabinet, yeah, heads will roll over nothing Can't fire the vice president, but you can fire anybody else.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I thought it was bold that he still kind of stuck to his guns and kind of talked shit about Esper, the defense secretary, and even General Kelly when they were talking about his chief of staff stuff like that. Yeah, those are two men that you know like earned their positions to be up that high.
Speaker 2:Mad Dog.
Speaker 1:Mattis right Right.
Speaker 2:Mattis is another one. Mad Dog couldn't work with him, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, when Mad Dog's the same person in the room.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what I've said to a lot of people who, um will be very pro military or pro veteran in one breath, but then dismiss these generals opinions and the exact same conversation and I just think, well, it can't be both. These guys are either really, really good at what they do and that's how they got to that level of performance, or, um, you know they're they're incompetent, and I don't think it can be both.
Speaker 2:I don't think you can be incompetent for 30 years to earn that fourth star you know, and like that's not how it works, or you don't get the fourth star pinned on and then somehow lose your mind. Right, right Like those two things aren't congruent with what we see from general officers.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, His, his attacks on the military and the whole Arlington stunt.
Speaker 2:You know it's just a constant disrespect for the military that it frustrates me how much support he gets from a lot of veterans, the idea that one of those general officers just was scorned or had some bone to pick, and so they essentially wrote an entire book about how terrible or dangerous somebody is. And Donald Trump's response? He's gone to one talking point about it, which is well, if your boss fired you, you'd probably write a bad book about him as well. Like how many people have I fired? There's no shortage of people out there that would say mean things about me.
Speaker 1:Right, and I'm like that's not the cell that you think it is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so you know that that's his answer is well, that guy's a jerk Cause I fired him and we all have to measure that and go. I don't think this makes sense.
Speaker 2:So pick and choose where you will, but that one's one, those statements from those generals that served in those civilian positions. I have to take their word for it. And on top of what we just we see it it's not hidden. You know what I'm saying? It's not hidden, so I don't know. The base requires him to just pour love all over the flag and literally hug the flag like he did that one time.
Speaker 2:That's what the base wants to see Donald Trump do, but when he does it, it's clearly unnatural and not a good fit for him. It's straight pandering, yeah, and so it just falls on completely deaf ears to me anyway, Right, you know, and it goes into that bucket of I can't believe almost anything you say. Anyway, you know, and it goes into that bucket of I can't believe almost anything you say, really you know.
Speaker 1:So yeah, it's definitely tough to watch, um, just cause you know I'm not a religious person. But him putting you know his name on the Bible and stuff like that. It's like, come on, man, like this is just wrong on so many levels.
Speaker 2:Yeah, the blatant, you know transgressions over all kinds of different things. That again, it's just part of the brand though that brashness is part of the message, you know, and so it's not we. We find it distasteful, but it is literally the battery, the juice. You know that the whole thing runs on, you know yeah, yeah, it's scary how well it sells you know.
Speaker 1:Yes, you know, yeah it's a he's, he's got a great product. That's what I've always said. He's a terrible businessman, but he's a great marketer yeah, like absolute genius marketer, and he's figured out something how to sell hype and hype is free.
Speaker 2:Right cost of goods and services on hype is zero. You know, yeah, yeah, well, I guess, enough about the debate, right, yeah?
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, yeah, the debate. At first I was thinking it would be nice to see another one, but I think you're right. I don't think there's much that Harris gets out of it. Just might as well just push forward with what they're doing on the ground.
Speaker 2:There's going to be a vice presidential debate though. Right, that is true, that's going to be curious to watch right there Talk about things that voters just don't care about. It'd be a vice presidential debate but for morbid curiosity of watching two guys go stand on the stage and argue with each other. It's going to be fun to watch right.
Speaker 1:I think it'll be pretty important because Trump's 78 years old now. He's not far away from—.
Speaker 2:Sure, I guess, yeah, so.
Speaker 1:JD Vance could be very quickly. Our president Sure.
Speaker 2:That should scare some folks. I mean it's not impossible. Yeah, Like that should scare some folks there. That's why he's there.
Speaker 1:I mean yeah, I mean the amount of cheeseburgers Trump seats in a year, but like he can't be far off.
Speaker 2:Fair. Fair, I guess there's some weight behind that right. But Fair, I guess there's some weight behind that right. But I mean, I think in the grand scheme of political things you know, most people won't even watch it. No, they won't.
Speaker 1:That does bring me up to something else that the group is working on or the Progressive Vets is working on. We're teaming up with Rich Lins, the stamp guy, doing a paid postage programming or program campaign postage programming or program campaign. But on the first, on the day of that debate, we're having a fundraiser and if you're interested in checking that out, you know, go to our website and check that out so that you know we can raise some funds. We're doing a thing where we deliver stamps to people who have a low propensity for voting, have a low propensity for voting, and that allows them to quickly return their envelope or their ballot when they get it in the mail. We did it a couple years ago. We saw a 38% increase in the younger demographics. Young people just don't have stamps now and they very quickly lose shit.
Speaker 2:Is this a QVC code? What is this? How do you put mail in the mailbox? Where does it go?
Speaker 1:So something we're trying to work on here locally is trying to get just everything sent out with a paid postage envelope on it California, Oregon, Washington, other states have done it and it works well where pretty much your mailbox is your Dropbox then, so you don't have to worry about finding one, because you know we're pretty lucky here. There's a lot of them spread around.
Speaker 2:Seems like there's a lot in the area, yeah.
Speaker 1:But when you get down south, there's fewer. You know there's always less in the areas that need it more, so just being able to have your mailbox be your Dropbox is the goal. But, yes, please check out our website. We have a fundraiser out there right now, so please give to that and help us all out.
Speaker 2:What's the website again? Epppcvcom.
Speaker 1:And there will be a campaign tab on there that we can check out. So go check that out. For me, yesterday was 9-11, obviously a big day for you know a lot of folks in our generation. You were down at Memorial Park, you know, taking part in the ceremonies down there. Tell us about your experience that you had down there yesterday. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Well, I mentioned to someone yesterday after the event that it was one of the best well-produced, I guess, 9-11 memorial events that I've been to ever, and so an additional credit goes to it. Was not run and put on by the military, it included the military and local base representation, but it was not a military ceremony and local base representation but it was not a military ceremony, and I was just impressed at how well everything was put together the displays, the location, everything was just great. As far as capturing the intent of the moment, I just haven't been to one that was quite that well done. Who were some of the speakers that were down there? There were two very interesting speakers. The mayor gave some comments, so that was his official, I guess memorial ceremony for the day was to go to that event. While he was speaking, the Colorado National Guard had a couple of jets fly over. The local fire department had brought out a giant, you know five-story tall flag and hung it from two fire ladders.
Speaker 2:And then the jets flew over the top of that.
Speaker 1:Nice. So it was. You know that part was good. Yeah, those are always cool too. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And that was during the mayor's remarks, and then they also had the as far as a person who had an interesting story from the day. He was the acting commander, he was a one star general and so he was like the watch officer of the day for Cheyenne mountain and, um, he was there, you know, on on watch, when the situation kicked off and he gave his account of how the watch floor from Cheyenne mountain responded to an airborne attack that had no playbook compared to what they expected as far as the Russian invasion or Russian bombings or long range missiles. This was not that, so the playbooks that they needed to execute did not line up with the threat.
Speaker 1:So they had to shift on the fly. Yeah, and even the ability to communicate. Like president Bush, that day, he landed in multiple locations because he couldn't get everybody he needed on the phone at the same time. So, like he, he struggled communicating with his leaders while we were under attack.
Speaker 2:That's terrible, right, I mean it's it's. It's not unbelievable because it's.
Speaker 2:It's very complicated mission to handle and it's one of those where you can exercise and exercise and then you really have to do it and it might not work you know, and I think, that's what the general was kind of sharing with us that day was there had been no shortage of exercises in the 40 year, 50 year existence of that resource, that facility, but it had never been activated in a real crisis Right, and so the blowing the dust off the playbooks was its own exercise, and it was very quickly understood that those were not adequate for the type of modern threat that was that exists after the Cold War.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And so that was really the takeaway from his speech. Was that how that, you know, spawned his speech, was how that spawned generational improvement of the resource that covers NORTHCOM and NORAD, the upgrades in technology, the understanding of different asymmetric threats. Just how much was informed in that first 24-hour period of capability was decades worth of kind of knowledge gained almost within a day.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So it was really interesting to hear him talk about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you know anything with, you know the NORTHCOM, STRATCOM, like those folks they have the strategic missions of dealing with our nuclear weapons. So when they start thinking about things they always like relate it back to that things they always like relate it back to that. So like, if there's a a lack of communication when dealing with with our nukes, that's like the crystal ball that we can never drop. You know, um, when there's any kind of lack of communication there, there's a, a real fear that it's going to be somebody that makes a decision that shouldn't have made that decision right. So like, yeah, they did. Uh, general cartwright was, uh, he was, I think, the three-star at Stratcom at the time, but he pushed for some pretty cool centers, you know, to kind of consolidate, you know, communication and be able to really reach out and touch everybody whenever you needed to.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but the ceremony was great. And then of course for the finishing part that's just impressive to see was the bagpipes. They did a bagpipe Amazing Grace kind of play out at the end and one bagpipe guy walked from kind of off the stage, if you will, down towards the stage, played it as a solo bagpipe and then once he got down there he did a facing movement and kind of turned around back towards the crowd. And then the dramatic aspect of it was you did not realize there was an entire crew of drum corps and bagpipe players behind the crowd and so once he turned and faced them they all fired off.
Speaker 2:And there was nine bagpipe dudes, know guys and gals and a drum corps of special you know types of drums and they marched him back to the formation where he wasn't playing and they were all playing and then when he joined the formation, he joined in as the last bagpipe. It was just super impressive so man whoever around here is keeping that crew trained and well practiced hats off right.
Speaker 2:You guys are doing a great job, guys and gals. There was young folks in the drum corps as well. That's cool. It's like they were school-age kids, so it's an interesting thing.
Speaker 1:The bagpipes are such a haunting sound to them. So in that scenario, that situation, that sounds like bone-chilling.
Speaker 2:It was, it was, it was and so you know again that contributed to how impressive and, I'll say, effective the memorial was.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And giving the right respect to everybody that lost their life and to remembering just sort of the continuing tragedy of the wars that followed after. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, that's great that the cities come together and do that. Um, I had a friend one time his uh retirement ceremony. He wanted bagpipes playing for it and he wanted, like, because, uh, corn has a song that starts off with bagpipes called shoots and ladders, and it's just, it's a cool little bagpipe thing, you that eerie haunting noise. And so we're having this at his church, his ceremony, and I give the iPad to the pastor who's running the sound and instead of just hitting play, he does something and he plays a different Korn song and it's the one that talks. It's pretty vulgar pretty upfront.
Speaker 1:And so as soon as I hear the song, I'm like that's not bagpipes, yeah. And then, like I play the lyrics in my head and I'm like, oh, that's going to get bad pretty quick. Yeah so like I'm like trying to like run across the back of the stage to like cut it off, but like we didn't get there in time, Technology. Yeah, technology, yeah, yeah, it's a great thing.
Speaker 2:that's funny um so who was it that actually threw the, the sir or the ceremony? That hosted the ceremony?
Speaker 1:it was the city of colorado springs, and there was um, the colorado chamber of commerce seemed to be kind of the primary sponsor, along with the city yeah, since I've gotten out and like kind of more involved in the community um this chambers of commerce, the fountain chamber of commerce, it seems like they would drive a lot of stuff just for like small, small things around here. You know that people just overlook how important it is these places. You had the ability to talk with some of those folks yesterday. Tell me about what happened there.
Speaker 2:So I was invited a week or two ago to sit on a panel. That I misunderstood the invitation, but in a pleasant way. Usually when I'm invited to those kinds of things, the panel is in front of a bigger audience, it's at some kind of conference or just some special event and there's an audience separate from the folks that are on the panel. What we had yesterday was the audience was all leadership from the city, the economic development department at the city and the county, veterans resources like the VBOC, Veteran Business Office and Coordination, I think it's called. So it was those types of folks. So it wasn't a general audience, it was more of a captive audience and there was five I believe there's five veterans that were business owners that had been invited and we were there to talk to them directly about our experiences of owning businesses and operating businesses in Colorado Springs and how being a veteran either benefits or hinders that process.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so what kind of things are available here for folks looking to start, you know, being an entrepreneur?
Speaker 2:Well, that was one of the topics that we covered in sort of two ways is one just the bare bones fact of what is here, but then the more 30,000 foot view of there's a lot of resources, but it's hard to sometimes for people to find the right ones Right, and so there's almost it's sifting through, you know kind of a flood of information and a flood of resources. The day that you decide I want to start a business and that you think your veteran experience or credentials are a benefit to that. How you marry those up and how you go out to seek resources. That can be challenging just trying to find the right place to land. And so that was one of the topics that we talked about yesterday was how all of us had either we're still in that lurch which a couple of folks on the panel said. I'm still struggling through that because I'm in the early days of my business and I've got a lot of permitting to do. I've got a lot of licensing to consider and tax zones of where we're at physically in the county. There's all these other factors that I'm struggling to get the right info. So you know that was a non-answer to your question what all resources are out there.
Speaker 2:There's a small business administration, which that was who was hosting it. Colorado Springs small business administration was really the host of the entire event. And then the there's there's sort of the local version. There's the state level kind of programs and there's the federal programs that all have some kind of small business focus. So you can sort of plug in at different levels and realistically they all kind of flow together once you get plugged into the right spot.
Speaker 2:So if you go to the Colorado Springs Small Business Administration, they're immediately having you apply for federal and state level programs, right Like they're there to coordinate your experience of getting funding, getting support, getting special business credentials, like as a disabled veteran or those kinds of things. They're there to facilitate that. So the resource as far as money or the final kind of who do you apply to to get something, is probably at the state or federal level. But if you plug in at that city or county level, they're there to just get you on the right path. So there's no shortage of that, there's a lot of that. And again, I just mentioned four different levels that it happens at city, county, state and federal right.
Speaker 1:So yeah, and at what level of a business plan do you need to have to even go to the small business association Like just an idea, like a business napkin?
Speaker 2:So Adam, I didn't tell you about this. We're going for another surprise little mental interview exercise here. We're going to put you Adam, because you're a veteran, you're retired, and we're going to put you in the position of being a new business owner, and I want to talk you through that process real quick. So let's do that, okay. So let's start with um. You're retired. Uh, you had a certain skillset in the military. Let's just start right there. If you were going to start a business now that you're out, would you want to do it based on your skillset in the military or would you want to do it based on some other passion or interest that you have outside of the military? I'd say, outside the military, yeah, okay, what can you? Can you share with us?
Speaker 1:So we're just in make-believe land. Yeah, so you know again infinite money. You can do whatever I want in the world. I would like to take like or make like a, a woodshop like teaching center where people can go just learn like different woodshop things. Sure.
Speaker 2:Okay, so there was two businesses on the panel yesterday that could compare to what you're talking about. There was one that teaches martial arts and like, uh, self-confidence and, like you know, just self-improvement for young people, like kids up through, like young adults. And then there was one that does, um, excuse me, marksmanship training and advanced, like combatives and advanced fire, you know, firefight type training, right, so those are both similar there and that it's uh, josh Monshap.
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Speaker 2:Great place to start. You would say, okay, this is what I'm passionate about. Now I have to decide that business requires a physical location. If you're starting something on the internet, you might be able to do it from your house, but it sounds like you need to find a physical location. Uh, you are probably.
Speaker 2:First step is I need to find where does it make sense for me to brick and mortar this? Oh sorry, don't tap on the table. Where does it make sense for me to brick and mortar this facility? And that is kind of the decision point that you know any business owner has to start with. So that's probably where you need to go start seeking resources. It's right there in the journey.
Speaker 2:You've got a good idea of what you think you want to do. It doesn't matter how much money you think you're going to make, how many customers. You don't need to know that yet. You just need to know what you. You need to have the vision.
Speaker 2:If you're the founder, you need the vision, and then you go find help to make that, flesh that vision out and turn it into more of a business plan where you can start to quantify things like how much money does it cost for me to open this and run it every month. Right, how many employees other than myself do I need? What kind of insurance do I have to have to allow people to come and use equipment in my facility? And that's where you get your. You know you start to run into okay, now I know how much money I need.
Speaker 2:And again you go back to your resources and say, now that I've got a better vision and I've got some measurements around that vision, I can go ask for funds. I can get a loan. Who should I talk to? And again that's where you step back into the maybe the veteran resources. At this point, and there may be more funding available because you're a veteran. There may be direct access to certain contracts or funding because you're a veteran. And so that's where you want to. You want to plug in right there. Right is to say, okay, now I'm going to start using my veteran credentials to benefit the growth of my business, and those organizations are there to help guide you in that as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah so reach out for resources really early, I think is the answer to your question, yeah.
Speaker 1:And through the Small Business Administration.
Speaker 2:Small Business Administration. Yeah, colorado Springs SBA is probably the best place to start, and they have, of course, the direct hotline over to the Veterans Business Office.
Speaker 1:So they work hand in hand, so you're not going to get lost or you're not going to go down one path and just you know not at least get exposure or learn about all the veteran resources that are available. Cool, yeah Well. Hey well, thanks for sharing. I mean, it sounds like you're really busy on the community. Uh, I try, it's fun talking to you cause you're always out there doing something. Um, thanks for uh coming by. Thanks for changing the name of the podcast.
Speaker 2:Thank you, adam. You know I want to. I want to take a minute and just say thanks for inviting me into this. Uh, I know that there was a there's a legacy here of you just say thanks for inviting me into this. I know that there was there's a legacy here of you know, it was somebody's idea, it was somebody's initiative to get it started, it was a group effort to say that this probably needed to exist and there was some strategic thought around what you were trying to achieve. So I appreciate the opportunity to support that strategy and, you know, hopefully make something interesting and engaging for our listeners but at the same time educate and inform and and just make it fun, so that we're talking about these kinds of heavy topics but we can get it back to that relatable sense. So I just love that you, you've given me the opportunity for that platform. So thanks, adam, thanks.
Speaker 1:Great talking. So everybody out there, thanks for listening to. Left face Nailed it. We appreciate your time. Anybody out there needs to reach out to us. Reach out through the website epccpvorg. You can see our events coming up there. We have the breakfast coming up November 9th, I believe it is for Veterans Day to celebrate that up in Manitou Springs at Persephone Grays. And then we have the paid postage stamp campaign on October 1st at Richland's Place. So sign up for there or buy tickets for that. They're free tickets but get a ticket for that. It's limited seating there, so check out the website epccpvorg and stay safe out there. Thanks, bye.
